First and foremost, I want to say that I don't want a verbal war over this. I like talking, debating and comments over these kind of issues but that's all, alright? At the end of the day, when it's been exhausted, let's just agree to disagree if we have to. Okay?
If the way I write offends any one, I don't mean to. I'll try to make this as uhh for want of a better word, professional as I can, not let emotions come into this and all, but I hope all of us will be mature enough to see this as a discussion and not personal attacks yah?
I'm not saying I know everything. I'm really not trying to be judgemental or arrogent. I'm just sharing what I know and feel and everyone's welcome to do the same.
Next. I apologise to shyama. Girl, I honestly didn't mean to hurt you. We've been through so much together and I'm sorry if I was insensitive.
Hmmm. Important things done. Let's begin round2. (:
Now. A diamond is changes its shape when viewed from different angles. In the same way, what is a fact to me may be an opinion to you.
Statement1: I disagree with tookie's idea that " sex before marriage...it is simply judgemental to say it is wrong".
It is not "simply judgemental". It is a fact.
See, we have to understand where each other is coming from. As smashworm said, "I don't know if your friend is a Christian, but we are. That is probably why we hold such strong views against issues like abortion and sexual relationships before marriage."
I believe in God. I have acknowledged Him as God. Therefore, what He says, I follow. Because He is God.
This, is where I'm coming from. That's why to Christians, pre-marital sex IS wrong.
I don't know who barcza is, but I'm definitely very suprised by your statements. You claim that "im also a christian" and then go on to say that "to publicly declare tt its wrong takes a very judgmental person in my opinion".
Hello? Tookie can say that bcz she doesn't acknowledge God, as her God. Therefore our convictions will obviously be different. But a Christian who claims that " i dun think pre-marital sex is gd, but honestly, i dun think its wrong either" should check the Bible. [barcza, as a Christian, you do believe that the Bible is the word of God Himself, don't you?]
Basically, what smashworm and I are saying is that as Christians, we have committed ourselves to God's laws and commandments [which are found in the Bible], one of which is, pre-matrital sex is wrong.
That's all. What I was saying in the previous post stemmed from my convictions and that is why I'm sorry I hurt a close friend of mine. I stand by what I said, but I didn't mean to cause pain.
Okay. So much for pre-marital sex. Next.
I'm curious as to where barcza got his/her ideas from. It's stated very clearly in the Bible that pre-marital sex is wrong. Find me any verse or passage that says that pre-marital sex [or adultry] is okay with God.
"like how the christians and the muslims now hack at each other constantly despite the bible and koran both saying not to kill your fellow man"
My reply: Do you think these Christians are really Christians, or do they just call themselves Christians? I can claim to be a guru in eating habits whereas in reality, I'm just a chocoholic. [This may not be the best analogy but give me a break. (:] My point is, many people say they are Christians. It's not up to me to decide if they are or not. But one good way is to see their actions. The Bible does say that thou shalt not kill. Go figure.
"besides, the christian faith has proven to be wrong on many occasions".
Me: Okay this is where I get really worried. Let me make this very clear. The Christian faith has yet to be proven wrong. What do you mean by "christian faith" anyway?
Number1. BIG difference between "christian faith", and the Church. If someone were to say that the Church has proven to be wrong on many occasions, I'm not going to be defensive and insist that no! the Church is perfect! The Church has indeed in the past, been wrong. The Church. Not the "christian faith". If the "christian faith" were EVER "proven to be wrong", then what I believe in is all for naught and Christianity is a sham. And why should I believe in something that has been proven to be wrong? It really isn't easy trying to follow God's laws. I wouldn't bother, if not for the fact that that the Bible has never been proven to be wrong.
I'm not too sure about the accuracy of the examples provided, "like tt time they threatened to excommunicate the guy who said the earth revolved around the sun. or when the church started all the witchhunts in europe" but I'll take your word for it. I'll even go one step further. The Church was so incredibly wrong and corrupted that the Reformation started. Heard of Martin Luther?
So, while the Church has been proven wrong before, it's bcz we're all imperfect and bound to make mistakes. But the faith we believe in, is 100% sure. That alright?
A little note on abortion here. Like pre-marital sex, I believe that it IS wrong. I believe that life starts the moment a sperm enters the egg and therefore, getting rid of a foetus is equal to getting rid of a human which adds up to murder. Again, this comes from what I believe in. I'm not going to force this down any one's throat. Just sharing my pov.
Fiftly[I've kind of lost count actually. heh.], "if the churches policies on contraception and abortion were realised, the social problems that will occur are astronomical. not to mention the earth is already overpopulated".
Me: Have more faith in your God, man. On what basis do you make your claim that "the earth is already overpopulated"? Did you know that if the world's resources were evenly spread out, there'd be enough for everyone? That means that if the filthy rich people all over the world shared their wealth with the poor, Everybody would have enough to eat.
Besides, I would think that God's in control over all this. He is God, after all. (:
Sooooo. This is an incredibly long post and I've come to the end of it. As with all my posts [check the one on bgr etc], I'm not sure what your reactions are but I welcome comments. Again, I'm sorry if the way I write offends anyone. I don't mean to.
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